Stop Smoking Crack Redux
In Stop Smoking Crack anon saidNo there's nothing from Wallace on the Harlequin boards. That was a different scandal. This started from her RWA "friends". I don't really know how all these tie together or why anon would tie them together unless she googled the commenters names. And I am too lazy to read the authors sites to piece together their common org's. So just going off the links given... comments Rhonda Nelson Julie Leto Kimberly Raye Alison Kent Jaci Burton Debra Webb Kristen Painter Evanne Lorraine Jenna Bayley ***if I recall correctly, this is the chick who pissed off the same crowd at eharl, maybe she has sucked it up since then and is now playing nice... maybe cuz she sold a book but since I recall her being told she would never eat lunch in this town again maybe it wasn't her, I really should go look must suck to be a wannabewriter and watching things you say with people for fear you could piss them off and they try to wreck your career MCRW Member Published Members: Nicole Byrd (Cheryl Zach and Michelle Place) Kendra Clark Robyn DeHart Anna DeStefano Haley Elizabeth Garwood Sherrilyn Kenyon/Kinley MacGregor Janice Lynn Kate Lyon Beth Pattillo Ramona Richards Dianna Love Snell Annie Solomon Marie-Nicole Ryan (Mary Varble) Debra Webb*****ding ding ding have a winner! Jody Wallace w/a Ellie Marvel Phyllis Bourne Williams GRW * Anna Adams * Bridget Anderson * Peggy Anderson * Leanne Banks * Beverly Barton * Stephanie Bond * Beverly Brandt (aka Jacey Ford) * Adrianne Byrd * Sandra Chastain * Lynn Collum * Jacquelyn Cook * Betty Cothran * Jan Dale * Jacquie D'Alessandro * Desiree Day * Anna DeStefano * Lyn Ellis (aka Virginia Ellis) * Wendy Etherington * Virginia Farmer * Jane Forgey (aka Beverly Rae) * Carla Fredd * Bonnie Gardner * Debby Giusti * Seressia Glass * Susan Goggins (aka Susan Hardy and Susan MacLand) * Dorie Graham * Jenni Grizzle (aka Jennifer St. Giles) * Carmen Green * Shannon Harper * Shirley Harrison * Karen Hawkins * Patti Callahan Henry * Rita Herron * Joan Hicks * Cynthia Homberger (aka Cindy Miles) * Linda Hughes * Nicole Jordan * Sherrilyn Kenyon (aka Kinley MacGregor) * Karen Kendall * Martha Kirkland * Nancy Knight * Jennifer LaBrecque****ding ding ding we have a winner * Amy Lanz (aka Amy Frazier) * Jackie Manning * Deborah Matthews * Janice Maynard * Carolyn McSparren * Tanya Michaels * Betsy Morgan * Celeste O. Norfleet * Mae Nunn * Elsa Nystrom * Carol Card Otten (aka C. J. Card and Tena Carlyle) * Jacqueline Pennington * Barbara Pierce * Berta Platas * Sari Robins * Sherry Schlereth (aka Sherry Taylor) * Gloria Dale Skinner * Haywood Smith * Jerry Lynn Smith * Dianna Love Snell * Donna Sterling * Lynda Stone * Pat Van Wie (aka Patricia Lewin) * Wendy Wax * Debra Webb****ding ding ding we have a winner * Ann Howard White * Karen White * Pat Worley southern magic MEET OUR PUBLISHED AUTHORS Bonnie Gardner - Website Linda Howard Martha Krieger aka Allison Knight - Website Deborah Matthews - Website Kristen Robinette Sherry Sands Lyn Stone - Website Gayle Wilson - Website Kelley St. John - Website Sherrilyn Kenyon - Website Rhonda Nelson - Website***ding ding ding we have a winner Kate Lyons - Website Debra Webb - Website***ding ding ding we have a winner Lynn Collum - Website Carolynn Carey - Website Giselle Carmichael - Website Kathleen Long - Website Paula Graves - Website Jennifer Echols - Website Soooo that must mean... Sybil has too much time on her hands and really should go finish Bound before sasha goes after her with a big stick. Or maybe edit a review or five I have half done. Or something... Really I have no clue what it means, you could guess Webb is deepthroat, maybe do a google search or twenty. Honestly don't know if that is what anon meant or what axe she has to grind with these people. Me? I like Alison Kent's books and think she is a swell person. Leto's book Making Waves was grand, the story in the baseball book not so much but more on that later. One I agree with in theory the other I couldn't disagree with more but I would buy their books again in a second. I liked The Player and something I read by Webb but their comments need to be bleached from my head before I can read them again. Raye is one of those authors I have SHIT loads of books from but never read. I still read MJD but did think about making these 7 or so books leave the house for the ubs. Jaci is one of those people who I think butter wouldn't melt in her mouth. Really, I want to like her books because she just seems so fucking nice. So her being a don't say anything if you don't have something nice to say person doesn't shock me. The rest I have already forgotten... there are some readers a few so so so fangirlie... a couple of writerwannabes who really should watch their mouths in the company they keep and there could be more authors but I am lazy and only did the ones I knew of or had nifty links I could click. So what have we learned today? Other than I can cut and paste like no ones business, really have to learn to use my time better and can click on a link with the best of them? Oh and anon has put a shitload of thought into this? nothing really... well other than I amuse easy but we knew that long ago... oh and I didn't bother with looking at the pictures cuz I was sure that was just added in the comments as a dig and really I could careless how authors look or don't look. |
posted by sybil
at
1:16:00 PM
This entry completly confused me. The one thing I can say is that the reason Jaci posted on that blog is because I directed her there via Alison's blog the day Alison first posted about it, because I thought what offended the original reviewer was hysterical and Jaci and I both decided we were going to buy the book, Jaci at RWA so she could get it signed. So she posted to the author. Other than that...no conspiracy there. *shaking head* these things seem to take on a life of their own...
By
Angela James, at 7/20/2006 02:43:00 PM
ROFLMAO Sybil! Loving it, loving you! I was going to check those links but I hate having to copy and paste...thanks for giving my lazy ass a way out!
I think you've got the jist of it with D. Webb being deepthroat. That was the name I kept seeing over and over also.
Now, I don't know about the rest of them but I'm on summer vacation so I have a reason to be sitting around here letting this consume entirely too much of my time!
Fiona
By
Kerri Wall, at 7/20/2006 02:44:00 PM
What are we talking about? I'm confused. Is this about the reviewer thing?
By
Karen Scott, at 7/20/2006 04:15:00 PM
usorry I should edit that in
the anon is the one who posted to the stop smoking crack thread
like three times so I figured she had a point she was trying to make *g*
you would think the point of posting anon would be to JUST SAY IT but whatever
By
sybil, at 7/20/2006 05:23:00 PM
LOL. Like Fi I didn't bother with all the cutting and pasting. So glad you did it for us.
Deep throat--Fi you're a riot.
By
Tara Marie, at 7/20/2006 06:14:00 PM
Too hilarious. But why the subterfuge? Anon really wanted to make people work for the answer. I love it.
By
Devon, at 7/20/2006 08:21:00 PM
So Debra Webb is googler extraordinaire aka Deep Throat. that would make this episode . . . blazegate?
By
Anonymous, at 7/20/2006 08:58:00 PM
I looked at all those links earlier. I wish anon had spelled it out, because my eyes simply glazed over at the names and I never saw ANY overlap between the various lists.
Most anons need to be a touch more straightforward in these things.
By
Suisan, at 7/20/2006 09:00:00 PM
Blazegate...hahahahahahaha
By
Kerri Wall, at 7/20/2006 10:20:00 PM
Blazegate! I lurve it.
I don't know why anon didn't spell it out, I mean hell when you go through the trouble of posting that many times just say what you mean.
geeze, but I am guessing since those are the links of choice that webb really pissed in anon's cheerios.
My cutting and pasting skills are all for you!
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 02:51:00 AM
Blazegate--too funny!
So I've been following along various blogs and, other than posting my thoughts on my own blog and rallying behind my buddy Jen, I have pretty much tried to stay out of this. However, after reading that Debra Webb--also a very good friend--is Deep Throat, I wanted to clarify a few things.
Er...just because a romance author is a member of several RWA Chapters isn't the least bit incriminating. Authors usually are members of any chapter within driving distance because of the newsletters and publicity. Networking, if you will.
And secondly, I don't know how other blog readers found J. Wallace, but Jen and I didn't use Google. The instant we heard the term "arc of the book" in her review we knew that it was a writer because that's not a term commonly used in Amazon reviews. We went to the RWA website, clicked on Tennessee, then MSRW and there she was. It took 30 seconds. Hardly a witch hunt.
I realize that many readers don't get why authors are so appalled by the fact that J. Wallace wrote such a negative review, but one thing that hasn't been brought up or taken into consideration is the fact that J. Wallace is a member of an organization which is reliant upon its published members to help them along the road to publication. As a member of RWA, she's benefited from workshops and the advice of other published writers. She’s welcome to her opinion--we all are and not a single author has said otherwise--but, IMO, it’s bad business and it’s tacky. Just my .02…
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 09:47:00 AM
The fact of the matter is that authors hate negative reviews and the first moment that they could do anything to strike back at a reviewer and have results, they could and that is tacky.
These motives aren't pure. Pure motives would be to send an email to J. Wallace (since it was soooo easy to track her down) and say it privately - hey, J Wallace, you are entitled to your review but that last line is pretty much an ad hominem attack. Good business sense tells us you should remove it.
To make a public stance. To out the reviewer as an author. To encourage the crowd of authors to engender support (like you don't have a private listserv amongst your selves). Those things speak to wanting payback. Just like Alison Kent's blog post was entitled.
By saying things like "the romance industry is very very small" and "I'll see you at RWA" is not saying that an author is entitled to her opinion. It's saying "if you don't scratch our back, you are going to bitch slapped down until you know your place which is to keep your mouth shut if you know what is good for you."
If the cheer group really was interested in giving her some good business advice and still welcome her to her opinion, the identity of the reviewer wouldn't never had been blogged about in the first place.
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 10:56:00 AM
Okay, now I've been at this too long.
Does this mean Rhonda Nelson is Deepthroat or LeBrecque herself?
By
Kerri Wall, at 7/21/2006 11:05:00 AM
Hey Rhonda! Thanks for stopping in and posting.
LOL hope you don't regret it :)
I do have two questions if you don't mind, well to you or anyone involved.
How does RWA and MSRW tie together? Are those two on the reviewer profile? If so, is Wallace the only author on RWA and MSRW in Tennessee?
Otherwise how is that any different than anon making it look like Webb is deep throat? They are both shot in the dark guesses that could damage either person with an untruth.
Not that I am saying either isn't true. Honestly I don't know or really really care. At the heart of it I have to agree with Jane and it goes back to my first question in my first post.
WHY? Why blog it? Why draw attention to it? Unless the author was pissed off about it. And most of all why out the author as a reviewer if it isn't known unless there was malice behind the idea.
With the facts I have, admittedly few, this really looks bad and not on the reviewer.
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 11:12:00 AM
Well, gee, I had no idea I was so famous. First of all, thanks to Rhonda for being a good friend and letting me know that this was going on. I had no idea. I initially posted my comment in support of Jen on both her blog and Rhonda's and then I thought nothing more of the whole situation. I have no idea who J. Wallace is or where she lives or what chapter she belongs to. I certainly have no bad feelings toward her other than, as I said in my "only" two posted comments on this subject. If she is an RWA member and I have only what others have said to go on, then she should not have spoken so harshly about a fellow author and her publisher in a public arena. Of course she is entitled to her opinion, but it's just not good busines to post it in such a public format. That's etiquette 101. Perhaps she and I have met at a conference or chapter meeting (the latter is doubtful since I rarely attend any), I don't remember but my memory where names are concerned is terrible! I have no chapter rosters in my home and would never use one to look someone up for negative purposes anyway. Personally, I don't have the time or the inclination to ferret out conspiracy theories or those who would incite them. I said what I had to say and that's the end of it. I would never go behind anyone's back and gossip, that's not my style. Anyone who knows me knows that. I don't have a blog, in fact I rarely read them or post. Bottom line, this, my friends, is a consumate waste of time and only reflects badly on the romance genre as a whole.
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 11:16:00 AM
I couldn't agree more that it reflects very very poorly on romance.
I still can't figure out why you guys think it is wallace or that the reviewer was an RWA member. Or why it matter if she/he is a RWA member.
Did you all email Wallace before publically linking her with a review she may or may have not done? Or did she have to wait for a friend to let her know?
Bottom line is the review wasn't bad and I would still think this was a boat load of wrong if the review had turn into bashing the editor and publisher - or the author. But I could at least understand the response.
This seems like a bunch of bitching and slander over nothing. So a stupid page of text upset someone's moral compass. I have a hard time seeing the trashing of the author.
I really think a thicker skin is called for here.
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 11:29:00 AM
Okay, let me take a stab at this:
Webb said:
“I initially posted my comment in support of Jen on both her blog and Rhonda's and then I thought nothing more of the whole situation.”
But then Webb turns around and says:
“If she is an RWA member and I have only what others have said to go on, then she should not have spoken so harshly about a fellow author and her publisher in a public arena.”
So obviously a little more thought and/or research has gone on to know that this is her publisher. And once again the sentiment arises: she can’t talk negatively about a book published by her publisher? I don't agree with that, of course, I don’t subscribe to the, “if you ain’t got nothing nice to say, keep your trap shut!” sentiment, which Ms. Webb does.
And finally:
“Bottom line, this, my friends, is a consumate waste of time and only reflects badly on the romance genre as a whole.”
And yet, you still fan the flames.
…Fiona…
By
Kerri Wall, at 7/21/2006 12:07:00 PM
Sybil & Jane,
I can't answer your questions since I have no idea what anyone else thought or what motivated their actions. I would have made my same comments had we been speaking about "any" business. Each industry, whatever it is, has a community and that community, no matter how large, is really rather small especially in terms of the Internet. It's just not good business to publicly bash someone who does the "buying" in that industry. I've had plenty of bad reviews and I always, always look at it as someone expressing their opinion--to which they are innately entitled. I, as well, have the right to believe what I want to about a review. I have the right to express my encouragement to a fellow author who is a friend and to caution whoever posted the review that it is not good business to bash a publishing house if you are an author or an inspiring author (which is exactly what I did). I never mentioned a name because it wasn't appropriate. I had nothing to do with figuring out who J. Wallace supposedly is and I certainly have not threatened her in any way or personally lashed out at her in a distasteful manner. Why would I? However, someone has done this to me by suggesting that I am the one who so called "outted" the reviewer. The whole concept is totally ridiculous to me. I would not waste time tracking down some reviewer. I haven't even done that for my own reviews, why would I do it for someone else? Wake up, folks, this is not the end of the world. It's a bad review and the reaction it unleashed. I voiced my support of the author and my advice to the reviewer, as stated above, end of story. Others may opt to drag this out and make it bigger than it needs to be but that's their problem. Whoever suggested my name in this controversy did to me exactly what they claim I did to the reviewer. This amazes me. There is no one more careful of others feelings than I am. I never, ever bad mouth others. It's wasted energy, bad vibes that will only come back to haunt you. I have no control over how others react, but I think it is safe to say that this entire discussion has outlived its purpose. Naming names and making hurtful, threatening remarks crosses a line. I do not appreciate being lumped in with such nonsense. In the future I will make my encouraging remarks to those who feel hurt in a private format. As for my very generic advice about the reviewer, IF she is an author, to say that she should not bash a publisher and shouldn't flex her superiority muscle by downing an author's work so harshly was just plain common sense. However, I have certainly learned a lesson.
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 12:31:00 PM
Fiona,
The thought and research is only what I have just read in this blog this morning so that I might respond to a situation where my name was used. I have not spoken to anyone or read anything elsewhere. I wouldn't have even known this comment about me was here had a friend not called to tell me. And when I said "her" publisher, I was speaking about Jen's publisher, not anyone elses. I don't even know if the reviewer has a publisher.
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 12:44:00 PM
Whoever suggested my name in this controversy did to me exactly what they claim I did to the reviewer.
As I was responding early I saw that and really wonder if that was anon's point all along cuz she/he/it hasn't been back.
Makes me wonder who anon was... you know I have had hits from Tennessee...
kidding! well not really but still it was a joke
anywho, I think we have to agree to disagree about the review because I so don't see the bash, trash, or whatever
But I do very much agree anyone wanting to work for anyone in any business shouldn't trash the person you want to pay you.
And I think it is grand that romance authors try to help newbies but think this wasn't the way to go about it.
Thanks for posting your thoughts! And braving a lil reader blog.
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 12:48:00 PM
Fiona, I don’t know who Deep Throat was. I think everyone did their own research. I’ve shared mine. And for the record, I do think that J. Wallace of Tennessee and Jody Wallace of MCRW are one in the same. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck… Also, she isn’t crying foul, so either she hasn’t heard about it--unlikely--or she’d rather not enter the fray. (Can’t blame here there, can we? )
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 12:56:00 PM
But really rhonda the important thing here:
Is what color is the ducks hat?
*g*
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 01:01:00 PM
*shaking head*
There are multiple arguments here:
*Should authors post comments like, "If you don't have something nice to say don't say anything at all." Which was my original beef.
*The attacking and outing of an Amazon reviewer by other authors.
*The thought that J Wallace bashed the publisher and editor in her review, which I just can't see.
*And ultimately, the etiquette of writing a review/giving book opinions.
Unfortunately for all involved, the line has been drawn in the sand and I hate to say I see readers on one side and authors on the other, and they're both doing nothing but slinging muck, myself included.
I'm done.
...Fiona...
By
Kerri Wall, at 7/21/2006 01:05:00 PM
Sybil, you said: Thanks for posting your thoughts! And braving a lil reader blog.
The readers are the ones who matter! As are the reviewers. We wouldn't have a business to be in if not for the readers and the reviewers. I hate to see this whole situation continue to escalate.
Thank you for letting me have my say.
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 01:08:00 PM
No problem, all being said I have no issue with disagreeing ;)
Tis all good
like a book mean jane may hate and I luv, I still expect her to fix my blog even if she has no taste in books and can't see the lurve in a good stripper story
LOL!
fi! And anyone else who has missed it, get thee to the ever fab blog of the even more fab wendy
awesome post on How to Write a Review
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 01:12:00 PM
Hey Sybil! Sorry I’m so late getting back to you. Much to do today. Daughter arrives home from camp--yay!--so we’re about to head out, but I wanted to take a stab at this before I leave.
** How does RWA and MSRW tie together? Are those two on the reviewer profile? If so, is Wallace the only author on RWA and MSRW in Tennessee?**
Okay, if you’ll look at her reviewer profile on Amazon--what she reviews, her nickname, etc--then look at her website, you’ll see what I’m talking about. Do I know that it’s her? Has she told me? No. But it’s easy enough to discern given what she’s made available on the internet. And you know how I feel about other authors trashing other authors because I’ve blogged/commented about it, so I won’t go there again. We see things differently. That’s fine. I’ll still come check out your site because you’re funny and honest and interesting and I'm guaranteed a laugh. No harm, no foul. I just didn’t want Deb dubbed Deep Throat when she’s been oblivious.
Also, myself personally, I don't think J. Wallace's review would have bothered *me* so much if she hadn't been an author. She *knows* what goes into producing a book--the work involved. She could have disliked it without being so catty, IMO.
Hope this comes through. Last time I posted, it vanished.
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 01:20:00 PM
Fiona, you're right about the mud-slinging, but like Deb, I appreciate having my say, even if I did get a little dirty.
Anyway, I vote we let the subject drop and talk about something else. I've been on a Johnny Depp kick lately. Please God tell me no one has issues with Depp. :-)
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 01:38:00 PM
Next you will ask if I have read Devil in Winter...
LOL
It Runs in the Family
For Anyone Playing the Home Game
Pirates!
I Love these Moments, I Like to wave at them as they pass by
How Much Do You Know About Davey Jones
WHAT? She asked...
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 01:44:00 PM
I've actually moved on to other things, but I'm curious about a few things...
1. As a reader I've used and seen other readers use the expression "arc of the book" so I don't see how this made anyone assume it was someone in publishing.
2. Why was it okay to "out" the reviewer? Why isn't this considered unprofessional?
3. How was the reviewer being unprofessional? A throw away line about 'convincing her editor' doesn't make her unprofessional.
The only way anyone would know whether or not she's an author was by actively searching for and outing her. As far as I can tell it wasn't the reviewer that was unprofessional.
By
Tara Marie, at 7/21/2006 02:23:00 PM
Anon here again to clear up a few points. Regarding the pix on the web pages, I didnt mean it as a slap about the authors appearance. It was to call attention to the Best Friends ForEVAR pix nothing more.
I started looking at RWA sites when I noticed that the comments on labreque's blog were within hours or even minutes of her post. How likely is that? I smelled collusion (sp?).
All I had to do was notice that the same people posting on Labreqe's blog were on Ronda Nelson's and Allison Kent's too, follow links to their pages, go to some RWA sites, look at some convention pix.
It was that easy. I never said specificly who I thought it was, just pointed out some awful intresting coincidences.
And thats ALL folks from me. Ta ta!
By
Anonymous, at 7/21/2006 03:55:00 PM
The only way anyone would know whether or not she's an author was by actively searching for and outing her. As far as I can tell it wasn't the reviewer that was unprofessional.
Ditto.
Completely agree.
Engaging in this behavior while smiling calmly and saying, "Well, we only did it for her own good" still qualifies as bullying.
I wrote a novel in the comments over at Smart Bitches about this sort of thing. I experience it every fricking day--please don't pretend that it's all coming from a place of friendship and warmth. It's not.
And I wish I could say I'm done with it, but I believe the only way I can truly walk away from this crap is to go on vacation. Now, how many pairs of underwear should I pack?
By
Suisan, at 7/21/2006 04:04:00 PM
Rhonda wrote:
I've been on a Johnny Depp kick lately. Please God tell me no one has issues with Depp. :-)
Are you kidding? He has to be the most overrated actor evah... which is why I simply refuse to go see POTC. The whole world's been brainwashed into thinking he's good looking too! *g*
By
Karen Scott, at 7/21/2006 04:09:00 PM
What did you say karen? I can't hear you... tra la la...
I have to say I agree with Tara's three questions. And I don't think anything was done to help anyone other than the author.
anon that would make you no better than whoever drew the line to wallace... tsk tsk you should at least have an IP address or something to have your back
And really, when did we get to the point when people are guilty until they prove they are innocent?
My big point out of all this is...
There isn't a point to trying to figure out WHO the reviewer was. It doesn't matter. Bad day fuck it, suck up a bad review and move on.
hmmm or better yet... go google these guys
What? Tell me you aren't wondering who they are ;)
By
sybil, at 7/21/2006 04:24:00 PM
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